Verified Streamer .com

[ISlot]

22 minutes ago, MrUKHackz said:

Changed or not the brand have to wear that permanently, maybe @phil_igp could incorporate something like if any casino has PREVIOUS form then they can't be on a verified players channel as it's too grey an area. Leopards don't change their spots do they.

his playing on Prime Gaming casinos

Edited July 29, 2021 by ISlot

[Rocknrolla]

I think this is a great idea and even though I do my best to try to not care as I'm hidden on youtube now it still boils me when I see it! Phil knows what he's doing and I can't really think of anyone else that could of done it. I would love to but it can't really come from a streamer it had to be independent.

Thats not to say it might need a bit more work and help but I like to think we can all work with him and the site as surely it can only be a good thing as at the moment there is nothing else out there and nobody else trying to do this.

I'm happy to go through the process myself to give some feedback. I was thinking we could also send someone through with some @MrUKHackz magic and see if its easy to see and pick up on fake web pages, screenshots etc.

The site has just started and you never know where this could lead, maybe twitch will use it, maybe twitch didn't even know this was a thing and will do because of it, maybe slot providers will only allow promotion of their slots by verified people as some are getting a shady name through streamers, maybe ukgc will adopt it, maybe ukgc will form their own because of it. Those ideas might sound far fetched but you just don't know and I'd like to help it and see where it can go.

 

[Secular Slots]

Yeah I agree Paul - its a good idea and no one else has put their neck on the line to start it on a major level. I know Ed at the Streaming shack has one he is trying to get off the ground also.

But its the instant doubt and abuse that new ideas get in this community that is a major issue. Let this thing build - it wont be perfect but at least they are trying to do the right thing.

 

[Joemama]

1 hour ago, phil_igp said:

Chip - Chip verified easily. Every deposit over the last 8 matched up with the corresponding casino. The income was shown (mix of affiliation and other) and none of it was amounts that would suggest to be in play for funded streaming. What you think of his "business" practice is up to you, but for the purposes of "if he real or not" the money is legitimate. We checked ID, POA, Source of funds, source of wealth, deposits, withdrawals, casino back offices, and historical banking and wallet data to ensure no credits were made from casinos for funded streams. 

 

2 of the streams that Chip got verified for he wasn't even in Ireland or on the stream, just his sidekick. So did you verify the other guys he streams with- looking at their bank statements etc, or if it was only chip that provided his statements then they would all be using the same account to gamble on during the stream no?  does that mean they are all streaming off the same casino account and breaching the casino T&C's? 

[4houghts]

cash converters do more checks for a buy back 

[philinvicta]

55 minutes ago, Secular Slots said:

One main thing I will say everyone is - even though you may say some people are fake, and rightly so, or that you may not agree with the Verified Streamer process etc - but it does not justify you personally attacking people.

Ask questions, have a debate but be polite. There is no need to attack people personally that you don't know. Just gather the evidence you need and make a decision if you wish to watch that person again. If you think they are fake, then don't watch them.

As i proved on the two videos i posted back in 2020 - at that time, if you were an affiliate you could not deposit real money at ANY of the Prime Partner sites, but that was 8 months ago - maybe that has changed. The first video already has been linked in this thread - here is my update one which was a few days later. 

As i said, no need to verbally attack people - just ask questions and make your own mind up. Only watch the channels you enjoy and leave it at that.

 

That is where you are wrong.  To say just make up your own mind and do not attack the people who are believed to be fake leaves a lot of naive and vulnerable people open to spending their hard earned on lining the pockets of people who are not  in any way realistic in the way they are gambling.  It is one thing to sign up through a site like this for affiliated sites where the person is making money  but completely different to allow people who are fake  to be allowed to stream on the likes of youtube and twitch   just to get people to sign up to affiliated sites.

In my opinion the UKGC  and other regulators should make it clear to licenced casinos that if they go out of their way to let people play in fake ways such as on play money or sponsor people in a way that they cannot lose just so they can stream and get people to sign up and lose   then they will be open to some large fines.  This should particularly  be the case where it is possible for young people to be exposed to these streams  eg the gamers  who suddenly play  slot games on their streams  due to being paid to do so.

Of course people who have an affiliate income  are going to use some of that money to play  or do giveaways  in an attempt   to get more sign ups to increase their income   because in the main they  are streaming at times that means they are not working in a "normal" job to fund their gambling.

In my opinion this way of verifying is not the way to go because as has been pointed out on this thread  the few people they have verified   have question marks over them  and it has taken the people on this site  to point out where the verifiers are going wrong.  It is also even more worrying that it is claimed that the people doing the verifying work in the industry doing this type of  work on a daily basis.

 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2021 by philinvicta

[philinvicta]

18 minutes ago, Secular Slots said:

Yeah I agree Paul - its a good idea and no one else has put their neck on the line to start it on a major level. I know Ed at the Streaming shack has one he is trying to get off the ground also.

But its the instant doubt and abuse that new ideas get in this community that is a major issue. Let this thing build - it wont be perfect but at least they are trying to do the right thing.

 

If they can not get it right they are doing more damage than good 

[Secular Slots]

1 minute ago, philinvicta said:

That is where you are wrong.  To say just make up your own mind and do not attack the people who are believed to be fake leaves a lot of naive and vulnerable people open to spending their hard earned on lining the pockets of people who are not  in any way realistic in the way they are gambling.  It is one thing to sign up through a site like this for affiliated sites where the person is making money  but completely different to allow people who are fake  to be allowed to stream on the likes of youtube and twitch   just to get people to sign up to affiliated sites.

In my opinion the UKGC  and other regulators should make it clear to licenced casinos that if they go out of their way to let people play in fake ways such as on play money or sponsor people in a way that they cannot lose just so they can stream and get people to sign up and lose   then they will be open to some large fines.  This should particularly  be the case where it is possible for young people to be exposed to these streams  eg the gamers  who suddenly play  slot games on their streams  due to be paid to do so.

Of course people who have an affiliate income  are going to use some of that money to play  or do giveaways  in an attempt   to get more sign ups to increase their income   because in the main they  are streaming at times that means they are not working in a "normal" job to fund their gambling.

In my opinion this way of verifying is not the way to go because as has been pointed out on this thread  the few people they have verified   have question marks over them  and it has taken the people on this site  to point out where the verifiers are going wrong.  It is also even more worrying that it is claimed that the people doing the verifying work in the industry doing this type of  work on a daily basis.

 

 

 

Don't get me wrong, I dont think these fake content makers should get away with it - I think their channels should be closed as too their affiliation accounts. What i meant was, don't abuse them personally - non need for vile abuse, even though they are lying and cheating people. Hit them where it hurts, their earnings or potential for earnings.

[ISlot]

25 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

I think this is a great idea and even though I do my best to try to not care as I'm hidden on youtube now it still boils me when I see it! Phil knows what he's doing and I can't really think of anyone else that could of done it. I would love to but it can't really come from a streamer it had to be independent.

Thats not to say it might need a bit more work and help but I like to think we can all work with him and the site as surely it can only be a good thing as at the moment there is nothing else out there and nobody else trying to do this.

I'm happy to go through the process myself to give some feedback. I was thinking we could also send someone through with some @MrUKHackz magic and see if its easy to see and pick up on fake web pages, screenshots etc.

The site has just started and you never know where this could lead, maybe twitch will use it, maybe twitch didn't even know this was a thing and will do because of it, maybe slot providers will only allow promotion of their slots by verified people as some are getting a shady name through streamers, maybe ukgc will adopt it, maybe ukgc will form their own because of it. Those ideas might sound far fetched but you just don't know and I'd like to help it and see where it can go.

 

On this side, they doing the same thing 

https://www.thestreamingshack.com/trusted-streamers/

 

[Levskie101]

So where does the funding come from for this site and verification process?

If verifying 300 streamers a year still wouldn’t make a profit what will sustain this going forward?

Roughly how much will this cost per year?
 

Have you contacted the UKGC if so what did they say about the site?

If somebody fails verification once are they able to apply again after a certain time period? 

 

[bigbucks1983]

1 hour ago, phil_igp said:

Hey Everyone.

Thanks for the twitter tag, didnt even think to come here and answer questions. Happy to help but please keep it civil. I dont want to start a slanging match. Ill try and answer those questions in order and as openly as possible.

Hideous - He hasnt asked to be verified yet. I dont get the hate on the guy either. But ill leave you all to that one.

Roshtein - If he tried to verify ill give you all a gift. There is no way thats real.

Chip - Chip verified easily. Every deposit over the last 8 matched up with the corresponding casino. The income was shown (mix of affiliation and other) and none of it was amounts that would suggest to be in play for funded streaming. What you think of his "business" practice is up to you, but for the purposes of "if he real or not" the money is legitimate. We checked ID, POA, Source of funds, source of wealth, deposits, withdrawals, casino back offices, and historical banking and wallet data to ensure no credits were made from casinos for funded streams. 

Ireland - This could be controversial, but streamers moving to Ireland... not really something thats a problem to anyone. People stream at the end of the day for income. It funds their gambling and/or makes a profit. If they think that moving to a country which has autospins/bonus buys will benefit them and provide better viewing its hardly illegal. Its not something that has any effect on if its real money or not.

Me - Yes this was my idea. I dont work for a casino, a provider, or an affiliate. I work as my main job as COO of a platform services company. We provide and build platforms, integrations, and (which helps with this project) KYC and verification services, which are used in the igaming world. 

Website - We have no links, sponsorship, affiliation deals, or income of any kind other than using staff at our own company to help assist in the build and running of the site. The cost of this was simply website (free) plus hosting (minimal) plus 3 verification agents part time (say 1k a month) on the side of their current job, plus a full time streamer manager (salary paid by us). Those are our costs.

Income - We will charge streamers to verify yes in the future. We are doing it for free currently.

DPA/GDPR - As mentioned in the Privacy Policy VerifiedStreamer is fully compliant with Regulation EU (2016/679) of the European Parliament and of the council of 27 April 2016 on the protection of natural persons with regard to the processing of the personal data and on free movement of such data, and directive 95/46/EC (General Data Protection Regulation) as well as The Maltese Data Protection Act (DPA – Chapter 586 of the Laws of Malta), as well as any other law related to data protection that might or will be published in relation to the DPA.
We take data security very seriously, this is the reason this project was launched as well - our goal is to make sure the data others provide - streamers - is legitimate.
All the information regarding the data handling is in the privacy policy, as is our DPO's contact if you need more details or have any questions.

Secular - Thanks for flagging that. If it turns out to be true we will of course redact any verification. I asked for information and we will verify this is it turns out to be real, or post a descriptive answer if what you claim is incorrect.

Respect - Making stuff up about me is charming, but sadly pointless. A simple search on google would show you what i do and have done. Ive gone against the MGA, UKGC before publically. Ive done podcasts and talks about streamers. Ive spoken at events and shows. On linkedin im the most followed person in gaming (i think, its close, but thats not a brag but you asked if anyone knows me). The problem you have is in actual gaming (Where people work at casinos, for service providiers, SaaS companies, game providers, they will all know me. Because i dont spend my time on forums with people who watch streams isnt something to be judged by. Thats like being a football fan for Milwall and decided that Usain bolt cant run very fast.

 

Verfication process  -  Ive offered this before. If our most sceptical person would like to be voted for by people, i offer them to come work with us for half a day. We will sign an NDA and contract (for DPA reasons) and they can see what we do and who we verify and how, talk to the team and actually know what we are doing before posting a load of shit about why it isnt important.

Most importantly - the reason for this;

 

Regulation and affiliation will change soon. There is no denying it. The wheels are in process already in the UK, with twitch in their sights and Youtube, and with the regulation of germany, sweden, estonia, USA, things will require a lot more openess from all sides. Just look at Germany last month, they changed their entire regulation to tax operators 5.3% of bets. Not profit. Bets. So every spin you make at 1 euro the government takes 5.3c. That makes operating there at 96 or 94% impossible. It makes live casino impossible as the casino will go bankrupt inside of days. So slots adjusted with government approval to 86-88% RTP. This is an absolute shitshow and we are lobbying them to change this method as all it will do (similar to the UK overregulation on certain things) is push people to curacao or crypto. While some curacao and crypto sites are well managed and run, some are not. And the odds of you getting scammed increase on this level. So its a stupid method but is one that a lot of countries are looking at. With this will change affiliation also, and streaming. 

The plan for the site was "to give something back" to the community. Personally i think the medium of streaming is great, but its corrupted. If the largest viewerbases are watching people have 100k bonus buys, insane wins that just arent jusitfyable, and having this "potential" thrown down their faces, people will have more and more problems with gambling and RG. This is unnacceptable as an industry and I thought something should be done about it. Others agreed (Bigwinboard for example, some slot providers who dont offer their games under 96% RTP or promote any sort of wins from them), even some casinos want to promote what we do as they dont allow fake funds on their casinos. To this ill take all the advertising i can get, why wouldnt you, but it doesnt mean we will promote them or start linking or sponsoring things. 

 

IF you have any questions let me know and im happy to answer, or if someone seriously want to take us up on the offer to come and see what we do then im all for it. But just keep it civil, im trying to start something that will turn the inustry into less of a grey area of advertising and a bit more in to the light. If it works then great. If it doesnt then we tried and will adjust. This isnt a business thats planned to make any profit, even if we verify 300 streamers a year we wont make any money. And thats fine. ITs expected. 

At the end of the day this was created and done as there was a need for an impartial company to create such a tool. If you dont feel its impartial tell me why. But do some research before launching any kind of accusation please, as we dont promote anyone. We have no benefit to verifying someone. If we verify some big view fake money bullshit streamer then we instantly lose all credibility, so why would we. We have 5 checks for streamers ot pass, with a 6th if anything strikes us as "out of place". They arent easy to do and if @Rocknrolla wants to verify its his choice, i wont push him, but he can explain what the process was after it there isnt a big secret to it.

 

Thanks for reading.

It seems you're only verifying if money is fake or real but the way the industry seems to have moved, that's only half the problem. Say a streamer gets paid per video but in turn get no affiliation income. Said streamer uses that payment to make another video, gets paid again and so the cycle continues. They still get to keep revenue from the 40 other casinos they promote. Technically they are using real money buy they carry no risk if they lose since they'll just get paid back what they lost in a fee. The huge difference is that their gambling carries zero risk compared to the punter they are trying to entice in. They will get to play higher stakes with no risk, give a false image of gambling and guess what.... you verify them and people will just interpret that meaning every deposit they made came out of their own pocket when in fact its not true.

The same applies for streamers with silly bonus deals where they only have to deposit small amounts to get a decent balance, again they are using real money but only a small amount. Their 1k balance holds totally different risk to my 1k balance. This let's them gamble entirely differently but hey, you verified them and people will believe its all above board. 

So just verifying if their deposits or withdrawals are real is actually just gonna help some streamers can legitimacy when they are totally misrepresenting gambling and the risks involved. Why do you think we see 10k wins with no reaction or 5k losses with no anger or regret.

It's concerning that someone with so much industry knowledge needs a forum to let him know about dodgy casino offers or mysterious balance increases and decreases. Particularly when one verified streamer was using one of the casinos in question.

You're clearly creating a brand/standard so how will you feel about streamers who you have verified as real that promote irresponsible gambling or the likes? 

Is it possible for some dodgy casinos and streamers to retroactively collude to get around your system? Do you go into their live system or just request screen shots?

Its nice someone is trying to do something but I think a lot more is needed beyond just is the money fake or real to create some integrity and avoid the possibility that your verification actually allows some questionable antics to be swept under the carpet.

[Rocknrolla]

11 minutes ago, ISlot said:

On this side, they doing the same thing 

https://www.thestreamingshack.com/trusted-streamers/

 

Yeh Ed is a top guy! For me this just needed to come from a more independent source

[bigbucks1983]

37 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

I think this is a great idea and even though I do my best to try to not care as I'm hidden on youtube now it still boils me when I see it! Phil knows what he's doing and I can't really think of anyone else that could of done it. I would love to but it can't really come from a streamer it had to be independent.

Thats not to say it might need a bit more work and help but I like to think we can all work with him and the site as surely it can only be a good thing as at the moment there is nothing else out there and nobody else trying to do this.

I'm happy to go through the process myself to give some feedback. I was thinking we could also send someone through with some @MrUKHackz magic and see if its easy to see and pick up on fake web pages, screenshots etc.

The site has just started and you never know where this could lead, maybe twitch will use it, maybe twitch didn't even know this was a thing and will do because of it, maybe slot providers will only allow promotion of their slots by verified people as some are getting a shady name through streamers, maybe ukgc will adopt it, maybe ukgc will form their own because of it. Those ideas might sound far fetched but you just don't know and I'd like to help it and see where it can go.

 

I love your optimism.

However if a product/idea is launched by supposed industry experts and a bunch of guys on a forum can pick it apart instantly/highlight major concerns then for me I won't hold any worth to the process. Even if the likes of you who I trust sign up, there's still all the questionable streamers that could slip through the net.

[Levskie101]

Even if you had a list of verified casinos I don’t think it would be fool proof however it’s hard to see what would be. There isn’t ever going to be repercussions for anybody to be found to not be playing legit, if you end up with 400 verified streamers it would surely take a colossal effort to verify them regularly enough to ensure they are not abusing the verified status by taking up dodgy offers 

[bigbucks1983]

2 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

Yeh Ed is a top guy! For me this just needed to come from a more independent source

How can we give any value to a streamer validation service that has its own affiliation links on the site? Talk about a conflict of interest.

Further, you realise you are listed as not contacted/untrusted. People will see your name and see untrusted and draw their own conclusions. I think that's bang out of order to add not trusted to a streamer they haven't contacted as later on they say not contacted means no communication from either party, how can they then say they arent trusted.

Too nice for your own good mate.

[Rocknrolla]

1 minute ago, bigbucks1983 said:

I love your optimism.

However if a product/idea is launched by supposed industry experts and a bunch of guys on a forum can pick it apart instantly/highlight major concerns then for me I won't hold any worth to the process. Even if the likes of you who I trust sign up, there's still all the questionable streamers that could slip through the net.

True but its also good that he's on here listening and taking it onboard, there's nothing more infuriating than someone who can't take constructive criticism. There's so much history on so many, its good that anything suspect we can msg him and he can look into it 

[MrUKHackz]

12 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

Yeh Ed is a top guy! For me this just needed to come from a more independent source

This top guy has listed you under UNTRUSTED on his site, that's not on imo just because you haven't jumped through his hoops for a badge.

[Rocknrolla]

3 minutes ago, bigbucks1983 said:

How can we give any value to a streamer validation service that has its own affiliation links on the site? Talk about a conflict of interest.

Further, you realise you are listed as not contacted/untrusted. People will see your name and see untrusted and draw their own conclusions. I think that's bang out of order to add not trusted to a streamer they haven't contacted as later on they say not contacted means no communication from either party, how can they then say they arent trusted.

Too nice for your own good mate.

Well I like to think even the the anti aff and fake haters at least know I'm real. Every comment I've ever had whether on forums, youtube comments etc there will be me underneath with screenshots or whatever they've asked for, takes 2mins to prove. I would be doing this more to support it and I guess it only really works if the majority of people do it as some fakes will just say well these streamers haven't done it so why should I?!

[ISlot]

Just now, Rocknrolla said:

Well I like to think even the the anti aff and fake haters at least know I'm real. Every comment I've ever had whether on forums, youtube comments etc there will be me underneath with screenshots or whatever they've asked for, takes 2mins to prove. I would be doing this more to support it and I guess it only really works if the majority of people do it as some fakes will just say well these streamers haven't done it so why should I?!

I wish If I was soft as you lol if he got me to UNTRUSTED I will make sure I will reply to him..don't ask who I will replay

[Rocknrolla]

6 minutes ago, MrUKHackz said:

This top guy has listed you under UNTRUSTED on his site, that's not on imo just because you haven't jumped through his hoops for a badge.

I don't think he's meaning that, maybe just trying to put pressure on some to do it

[ISlot]

2 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

I don't think he's meaning that, maybe just trying to put pressure on some to do it

yes looks like he forgot Bandit

[MrUKHackz]

3 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

I don't think he's meaning that, maybe just trying to put pressure on some to do it

Still naughty imo.

[Guest andywilliams1187]

9 minutes ago, Rocknrolla said:

Well I like to think even the the anti aff and fake haters at least know I'm real. Every comment I've ever had whether on forums, youtube comments etc there will be me underneath with screenshots or whatever they've asked for, takes 2mins to prove. I would be doing this more to support it and I guess it only really works if the majority of people do it as some fakes will just say well these streamers haven't done it so why should I?!

Are you still going to do your piece on the crypto casinos mate? Just wondering as i think you said a while ago you were going to do a post/video on it?

[Eaves21]

Afternoon Paul hope you are well mate. 
 

To everyone on this post I wanted to jump in as I’ve seen so much hate about regarding verified streamers. 
 

I want to point a few things out. My site that has been up and running for a while now we verify trusted streamers. So this is streamers using their own money (not funded by casinos a mate or another streamer. For example if a streamer stated they was involved with another streamer and they help fund their streams and it did not come from a casino, I would class that as trusted. The same if a provider was paying a streamer to do videos. If the streamer told his viewers it was a paid promotion it’s trusted. So you may see more people on the new site that you would on my site. 
Verified streamers is not a bad site it’s a new site that is doing similar to what we are doing but run by people a lot people higher up then my self. I for one run the day to day costs of my website and with licences for gdpr and so on is very cheap. I imagine verified streamers is a lot more expensive as they have teams working for them. 
I see many trolling/ slating what they are doing. I understand people have questions on what is going on. I my self spoke with Phill as I had questions and I was invited to go over and learn and watch what they are doing. I was also invited on a land based casino trip. I have also messaged Phill again today as I do have more questions to ask regarding events lately but everyone please remember that if a streamer has been verified on my site or there site or where ever. That is purely to show they used legit funds on say 3 of last videos or streams. If you know they are dishonest streamers and have some evidence they use dodgy money on sites then use the contact pages on the site they are verified on. This would then be checked and if found out to be dodgy/ u trust worthy the they would be removed from the site they verified on. On the plus side once these streamers have been checked and placed on a site as legit they could never go back to using fake funds as they don’t just get left on a site and forgot about. They can be approached monthly / weekly or even straight after a stream to provide proof of it. 
This is a slow growing venture that eventually will leave the fake dishonest streamers on there own. Over time one day a streamer could be gone off one of the sites if found to be dishonest. I think we should all support what we are all trying to achieve here at make this industry more honest and more enjoyable for every one as well as keep it realistic and safe. 

[Rocknrolla]

1 minute ago, andywilliams1187 said:

Are you still going to do your piece on the crypto casinos mate? Just wondering as i think you said a while ago you were going to do a post/video on it?

I did a very small post on it which I did/do intend to edit and put more on it but was only really doing it as I get asked about the same old crypto fake fudgers on every stream, so I just wanted a post to link to the question as talking about it does get me riled up, whereas these days as I don't watch any of them, don't get recommended any and feel at peace ha!