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thewweEDGEHAD

Fold AA before the bubble

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7 minutes ago, Markymark said:

 

Definitely mate, you need to play the hand on its merit wither first hand or last, you've got this far by playing that way. 

im with you

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It has been mentioned but only time would be if it were a satellite where I'm more or less comfortable to make it into the prize pool. 

Or

If I'm a small stack bleeding into the money where a double up isn't going to really improve my stack size greatly. Say 5/6 blinds or lower then just give it up and accept the min cash.

Every other scenario the chips are going in the middle and I'm high fiving the table till I get coolered 😂

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I would recommend you never play poker again if you are folding aces preflop. 😂

But for real I would consider (maybe) that if the next pay jump is life changing sum of money lets say WSOP main event 9 left and 3 go allin before you and you are all around equal amount of chips so there will be people busting out but even then it would be hard as fuck to fold, I wouldnt be able to fold aces preflop ever I rather bust and get a million less than fold and see how the aces would hold, I would eat myself alive.

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You fold in the qualifiers where you are so good with chips and there is only 1 to bust for you to get the ticket like @Kev40 said where is no point of risking playing any hand basiclly.

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It depends how bad you need the money in my opinion. If your a gambler and money doesn't matter win/loose then you shove all day long. Poker is about finding spots and going for it. I shove all day long purely because you spend your whole tourney waiting for aces then when you finally do you have to play them. This massively depends on stack sizes players etc etc some people maybe sitting there thinking the exact same thing. It's a tough one but I shove all day long. Xx

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31 minutes ago, Kinkerbells said:

It depends how bad you need the money in my opinion. If your a gambler and money doesn't matter win/loose then you shove all day long. Poker is about finding spots and going for it. I shove all day long purely because you spend your whole tourney waiting for aces then when you finally do you have to play them. This massively depends on stack sizes players etc etc some people maybe sitting there thinking the exact same thing. It's a tough one but I shove all day long. Xx

How is a tough one to call with the best possible hand? 😂 My mind is blown on this forum when there is a talk about hands. There is still a ton of money to be make in poker these days for sure. 😂

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I would never fold unless it was a sat. You have to imagine what these players ranges will be to jam all in and call on the bubble most will be premium hands like AK, KK, QQ, JJ or 10/10 perhaps a few weaker A/x combos so you may have no outs but you'll have the majority dominated - I'd rather be against a bunch of Ax hands and pocket pairs over hands like 89s for example and you'll have a few players trying  to abuse the bubble and raising with absolute trash. Either way you can't fold, if you win the hand you'll most likely go on to finish top 4.

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2 hours ago, crazyrightmeow said:

How is a tough one to call with the best possible hand? 😂 My mind is blown on this forum when there is a talk about hands. There is still a ton of money to be make in poker these days for sure. 😂

Like I said I push all day every day but I have heard this before where people will just fold their way through the money. It is crazy but it happens

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1 minute ago, Kinkerbells said:

Like I said I push all day every day but I have heard this before where people will just told their way through the money. It is crazy but it happens

Whales 🤑

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1 hour ago, crazyrightmeow said:

How is a tough one to call with the best possible hand? 😂 My mind is blown on this forum when there is a talk about hands. There is still a ton of money to be make in poker these days for sure. 😂

I'm by no means an expert 😂 But my opinion is its more looking at it from a long term perspective.

If your a recreational player playing a couple of tournaments then no point folding but if you have a bankroll of 100/200 tournament buy ins then there are definetly situations if you were super short where you fold into the money and just take the 1+buy in from the min cash.

Also have to look at your equity in tournament if you win the hand. If it puts you in with a chance of making a deep run then worth going for it but if winning the hand still puts you 333/340.....you get the point.

Only talking about very specific scenarios where you would consider folding but agree there are times I could find a fold

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1 minute ago, Sirbetsalot said:

I'm by no means an expert 😂 But my opinion is its more looking at it from a long term perspective.

If your a recreational player playing a couple of tournaments then no point folding but if you have a bankroll of 100/200 tournament buy ins then there are definetly situations if you were super short where you fold into the money and just take the 1+buy in from the min cash.

Also have to look at your equity in tournament if you win the hand. If it puts you in with a chance of making a deep run then worth going for it but if winning the hand still puts you 333/340.....you get the point.

Only talking about very specific scenarios where you would consider folding but agree there are times I could find a fold

Well as player that played 15-20k tournaments online alone I can tell you that if you are short you are even more happier to see a good hand to stick it in and it doesnt matter in what point of the tourney, you never play for a min cash. You always have to play optimal if you want to be profitable player and if you start folding for min cashes you will lose a ton on the long run. In tourneys you really get paid in top 5 or mostly even top 3 so if you dont play for the win that itm min cashes means jack shit and will eat you alive as soon you will run bad and that happens a lot trust me. Ive been thousands of mtts without a top 5 finish and its not fun and if I would start folding aces on the bubbles I would never even come to getting back up.
So playing for min cash is a huge -EV if you are regular player, never do that if you want to be profitable.
 

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5 minutes ago, crazyrightmeow said:

Well as player that played 15-20k tournaments online alone I can tell you that if you are short you are even more happier to see a good hand to stick it in and it doesnt matter in what point of the tourney, you never play for a min cash. You always have to play optimal if you want to be profitable player and if you start folding for min cashes you will lose a ton on the long run. In tourneys you really get paid in top 5 or mostly even top 3 so if you dont play for the win that itm min cashes means jack shit and will eat you alive as soon you will run bad and that happens a lot trust me. Ive been thousands of mtts without a top 5 finish and its not fun and if I would start folding aces on the bubbles I would never even come to getting back up.
So playing for min cash is a huge -EV if you are regular player, never do that if you want to be profitable.
 

So if you are in a tourny with a WSOP package on the line and in the small blind with hand to hand play in progress you think it would be right to end up all in

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1 minute ago, philinvicta said:

So if you are in a tourny with a WSOP package on the line and in the small blind with hand to hand play in progress you think it would be right to end up all in

If you read my previous posts in this thread you will see that I mentioned qualifiers when you have good enough stack to get in that is no point of playing any hand at all.

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29 minutes ago, philinvicta said:

So if you are in a tourny with a WSOP package on the line and in the small blind with hand to hand play in progress you think it would be right to end up all in

Depends on how many players recieve the WSOP ticket, players remaining and the size of your stack and your opponents. 

If there was 5 tickets to be won and 100 players left then then I would rip it in with AA Sb vs BB regardless of stack size 

If there was 20 tickets to be won and 30 players left and the BB had me out chipped or a similar stack size then I wouldn't but I would call a jam, if they was short stacked then I would 100% jam

It all depends on the situation and risk and if the reward is worth it. 

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1 hour ago, crazyrightmeow said:

Well as player that played 15-20k tournaments online alone I can tell you that if you are short you are even more happier to see a good hand to stick it in and it doesnt matter in what point of the tourney, you never play for a min cash. You always have to play optimal if you want to be profitable player and if you start folding for min cashes you will lose a ton on the long run. In tourneys you really get paid in top 5 or mostly even top 3 so if you dont play for the win that itm min cashes means jack shit and will eat you alive as soon you will run bad and that happens a lot trust me. Ive been thousands of mtts without a top 5 finish and its not fun and if I would start folding aces on the bubbles I would never even come to getting back up.
So playing for min cash is a huge -EV if you are regular player, never do that if you want to be profitable.
 

Just have to agree to disagree on this one.

Not about playing for a min cash but playing smart with the amount of chips you have and the money that can be made.

Again I'm talking very very specific scenarios, but if you're never even considering folding aces on the stone bubble regardless of how short you are or how many other players are in covering you that doesn't seem correct.

Blanket statement of I have aces so it's  going in doesn't seem +ev to me

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1 minute ago, Sirbetsalot said:

Just have to agree to disagree on this one.

Not about playing for a min cash but playing smart with the amount of chips you have and the money that can be made.

Again I'm talking very very specific scenarios, but if you're never even considering folding aces on the stone bubble regardless of how short you are or how many other players are in covering you that doesn't seem correct.

Blanket statement of I have aces so it's  going in doesn't seem +ev to me

Well keep on losing money on the long run then, we need losing players in the pound anyways so I am happy with your disagreement. 🤑😂
Its not what seems +ev to you but what is gto and mathematically correct.

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6 minutes ago, crazyrightmeow said:

Well keep on losing money on the long run then, we need losing players in the pound anyways so I am happy with your disagreement. 🤑😂
Its not what seems +ev to you but what is gto and mathematically correct.

No worries man, will do 👍

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I think when there's 3 all ins in front of you, depending where you are and how many are on the table, the third guy who is all in almost have to have QQ or KK. 

It depends on chips and positioning and players, the first guys range is pretty big (depending on stack and position) you'd have to guess a8-ak and 6's - JJ maybe. 

Second guy is 10s-q's and maybe aq / ak if he's looking to isolate. Third guy is pretty isolated in terms of range. Again depending on stacks and no.s at the table, it's ak / QQ / kk / aa. 

You're probably losing to a flush most of the time or a set. A set has 2 outs (maybe 2 players with pocket pairs) so 4 outs and a flush - you cover the top 2 flush possibilities with your hand. 

I don't think there's really much of an argument for folding. I get the life changing amount thing I guess, but you win so many times in the long run for it not to be profitable to call

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10 hours ago, Luke_B_123 said:

I think when there's 3 all ins in front of you, depending where you are and how many are on the table, the third guy who is all in almost have to have QQ or KK. 

It depends on chips and positioning and players, the first guys range is pretty big (depending on stack and position) you'd have to guess a8-ak and 6's - JJ maybe. 

Second guy is 10s-q's and maybe aq / ak if he's looking to isolate. Third guy is pretty isolated in terms of range. Again depending on stacks and no.s at the table, it's ak / QQ / kk / aa. 

You're probably losing to a flush most of the time or a set. A set has 2 outs (maybe 2 players with pocket pairs) so 4 outs and a flush - you cover the top 2 flush possibilities with your hand. 

I don't think there's really much of an argument for folding. I get the life changing amount thing I guess, but you win so many times in the long run for it not to be profitable to call

Yes.. I guess if you fold that hand you better dont even start

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This also comes down to ICM a bit. How short are you? How big is the money compared to your avg win and stake? 

 

If its a sattelite then absolutely fold. No point playing it you win a seat already. If its a standard tourney then i cant fold this ever. The EV of the chips youd win far outweights the chance of busting.

 

WSOP ME - Hmm. Depends how much you want to cash 🙂

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40 minutes ago, phil_igp said:

This also comes down to ICM a bit. How short are you? How big is the money compared to your avg win and stake? 

 

If its a sattelite then absolutely fold. No point playing it you win a seat already. If its a standard tourney then i cant fold this ever. The EV of the chips youd win far outweights the chance of busting.

 

WSOP ME - Hmm. Depends how much you want to cash 🙂

yeah sattelite no question but on WSOP Its a call in my mind 😄

 

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Someone did this yesterday in the wsop main event, on the bubble, he folded AA pre flop, he did make the money which is $15k minimum

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15 hours ago, Adz Adzy said:

Someone did this yesterday in the wsop main event, on the bubble, he folded AA pre flop, he did make the money which is $15k minimum

hmm for real ?

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On 11/07/2019 at 10:27, thewweEDGEHAD said:

hmm for real ?

yep it was for real, the commentator's were talking about it during the main event

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